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Do you REALLY use multilib?

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Everyone,

There is an effort under way in Gentoo-land to add the ability for lots of ebuilds to optionally compile as 32-bit ebuilds on 64-bit systems (via an eclass,) so that they can be used to fulfill dependencies for 32-bit binary apps that you may be using, like Skype. It looks like the goal of this is to replace emul-linux-x86* ebuilds which package binary 32-bit libraries for this purpose, and is thus notably un-gentoo-like.

 

I'm wondering how many people out there take advantage of multilib at all. I know I use multilib for Skype, but that's it.

 

You can tell if an ebuild uses the 32-bit dependencies if it depends (actually, RDEPENDS) on anything starting with emul-linux-x86. You can grep /var/db/pkg and see if you have anything.

 

It's (as far as I know) pretty much only needed for pre-built binary apps that run in 32-bit mode on 64-bit systems.

 

When I first created Gentoo 64-bit, I intentionally avoided supporting multilib (32-bit runtime) support, and wanted to try to do all of this in a chroot, to keep ebuilds simple. Well, the devs at Gentoo went ahead and added it anyway, and it has been a big mess. I am also wondering how many people have played around with running 32-bit apps in a 32-bit chroot. I am wondering if I could get Skype working this way. It would take up more disk space but would be a cleaner approach.

 

-Daniel

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Yes definitely, some legacy 32 bits gear still exists and will exist for awhile (think about flash player just to quote one case). Also maybe not the best example around however there are some issues in dosbox with some old games running inside a 64 bits box (scrambled display). Unfortunately x86 is a messy architecture and binary backward compatibility is, at least for now, more or less mandatory depending of course of what you are using. Some proprietary software I use for some of my rig under Linux is also 32 bits. May be some solution will lie in the stabilization of this famous "x32"? Getting rid of those pre-built libraries will help, at least to keep a lean dependency tree... 

 

Sure you can split but if you split you must maintain two systems with all the joys this brings in, this is absolutely not "smooth" for the end user... 

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I too use multilib... Also I would like to keep it or something that works like it incase I need to run a 32 bit binary. Some software is 32 bit only like firefox-bin and iirc libreoffice-bin which install much faster than building them from source.

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Hi,

 

32bits libs are used here for games ( steam, emulators, wine ).

I once tried the abi_x86_32 thing ( what a mess ! ) and the result is : i'm not ready to compile twice my system.

So i think i could easily forget about gaming in funtoo 64bits.

I'll try to setup a chroot for steam and wine instead.

 

There 's no 64 bits steam planned yet.

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I recently used one of our pure64 builds to set up a Funtoo server at home, and it's running great. I'm running Plex media server on it, which runs just fine in 64-bit.

 

I think pure64 makes a lot of sense for server deployments -- am I right in concluding that the big need for 32-bit is on desktop systems?

 

I'd imagine that any server software worth its salt would have a true 64-bit version.

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I, too, use Steam, which requires 32bit.  Other than that, I try to stick to only 64bit (my Plex server is also 64bit)

 

Daniel, you reference running 32 bit clients in a chroot; do you happen to have any documentation already written up on the procedure for that?

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Yes, Funtoo, suffers from time to time with new multilib transition. The idea of new multilib is probably not bad, gettin rid of emul-linux-*packages. But it's done very creepy. Some converted packages are masked, some only ~keyworded and some are stable. This leading to various uncertain portage issues. I'm more tend to just use either pure64 or x86, like arch linux does. I know sabayon abbandoned 32 bit support. Sorry, cross-posting from mail.

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Hi, a *too desktop and server power user/admin here.

 

From a desktop perspective: Wine, skype, and some old binaries (can't think of one now) may still need 32b support (what about flash --which I've abandoned and chromium with pepper does the job for me now-- and java?)

From a server perspective: I've suffered a royal PITA some time ago with a NAS from NEC which required a specific version of java (32b of course) for the management console. The customer had installed opensuse 2012 and replacing it was not an option.

 

I think that chroot/virtualization/whichever-jailed-environment is not an elegant solution.

 

Cheers,

 

PeGa!

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One fruit of this discussion is that I think we need to mention our pure64 builds on our official install documentation, and recommend pure64 for servers.

 

funtoo-current regular x86-32bit or x86-64bit builds (multilib) shoud be used for desktop systems.

 

The pure64 build is working great as a server OS and more people should be aware of it as an option.

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I use multilib for Steam, Skype, Wine, and some others as well that I can't name off the top of my head just now. Those emul ebuilds continue to be incredibly useful. I would be open to trying a multilib experiment if we found one.

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Is 64 bits better than 32 bits for a simple desktop user? Have someone a 64bit processor but still in a 32bit system? An user that use internet, skype and steam... Some interesting text:

- http://archive09.linux.com/articles/114024?tid=121(is a bit old - 2005)

- http://archive09.linux.com/feature/43873(is a bit old - 2005)

- https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-349691.html

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