Jump to content


  • Content Count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won


Reputation Activity

  1. Trolling
    pr1vacy got a reaction from uudruid74 in addwifi command not found   
    Check and see if network manager is running. Login as root then:
    # nmcli d Get your wifi device name. Probably wlan0. Next:
    # nmcli d wifi connect <WiFiSSID> password <WiFiPassword> iface wlan0
  2. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to cardinal in aalib install issue   
    This isn't true on my system if @world is "/var/lib/portage/world".
    After removing sudo I install with this command:
    funtoo rj # emerge -av =app-admin/sudo-1.8.15-r1 funtoo rj # grep sudo /var/lib/portage/world app-admin/sudo No version is pinned (appended) to sudo which would prevent an update.
  3. Trolling
    pr1vacy got a reaction from nrc in My 2 cents on systemd   
    On a sidenote...but relative as it's an example of some attitudes toward systemd....was installing profile-sync-dameon...ie..psd....and ended up seeing this...read down a bit at the NOTE FOR VERSION 6:
    Some people are just lazy.
  4. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to nrc in My 2 cents on systemd   
    As uudruid74 pointed out earlier in the thread, Funtoo doesn't exist to provide you with the "industry standard" anything.  If that alienates someone then Funtoo isn't the right distribution for them anyway.
    To quote the Wiki: "Funtoo Linux is a project of people who agree with the philosophy of the ideal tool, and who are passionate in our desire to improve technology to be as close to this ideal as possible."   That's the purpose of Funtoo - for the BDFL and like-minded individuals to pursue the ideal tool in each instance and share the results with those of similar mindset.
    "The ideal tool" is similar to the "small, sharp tools" that are the core of the UNIX philosophy.  Not only does systemd run counter to that philosophy as an init system but it also pre-empts attempts to create "the ideal tool" in many of the technologies that have fallen prey to its all-consuming hunger to control every aspect of your system.  Elegant tools like boot-update and Funtoo's core networking templates would be rendered moot by systemd imposed kludges.
    Simply put, systemd is contradictory to the core principle of Funtoo.  Funtoo with systemd wouldn't be Funtoo.
    All those choices weren't based on merit.  Some distributions chose systemd because they had little other choice.  Redhat controls many of the projects they rely on and they felt that they didn't have the resources to create replacements or deal with all the incompatibilities that Poettering was creating.
    Fortunately the smaller distributions that have declined to adopt systemd have made better progress at working around those issues than some thought would be possible at this stage.
    The opinion that you're expressing contradicts the Funtoo vision.   If you want systemd you don't understand that vision and you're using the wrong distribution.
  5. Trolling
    pr1vacy got a reaction from uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Ignorance is bliss. I smell a shill.
    Read: https://igurublog.wordpress.com/2015/05/04/kdbus-systemds-kid-cousin-come-to-stay/
  6. Trolling
    pr1vacy got a reaction from cusco-travel-services in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Ignorance is bliss. I smell a shill.
    Read: https://igurublog.wordpress.com/2015/05/04/kdbus-systemds-kid-cousin-come-to-stay/
  7. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Your own post is my proof. You said it would be easier to accept systemd rather than maintain changes to projects such as Gnome (which is another RedHat funded/controlled project I might add).
    You act like it was extra work to remove systemd support from Gnome, like without the changes we'd have a choice. The opposite is true. Gnome is hard dependant on systemd and it was changed to allow a choice. So, your example is perfect. Gnome's reliance on systemd pretty much causes the distro to switch to systemd. Even if you don't install Gnome, the requirement for systemd in order to be able to run Gnome causes so many changes elsewhere (the main complaint many of us have) that you are basically strong-armed into a full systemd switch-over. Sadly, I like Gnome. Even anti-Gnome distros switch to 'jump on the bandwagon' as many have suggested.
    Your line of thinking is exactly what happened and EASY took over rather than any technical merit. See Google for sticky details.
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  8. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Nope. Supporting systemd means supporting two versions of all the things that systemd had polluted. Why should Funtoo give you a choice when none of the major distributions do? 
    And again, I don't care what everyone else does. I don't use bind for DNS. I was one of the first to stop using sendmail. I was a very early proponent of Linux. I've never done what everyone else does, and the Linux community hasn't really followed such a mindset in the past.
    You assume that the switch to systemd was made because its better, and not due to duress. And from what I saw that's not what happened. Debian is a great example. The history of the rift there is all open for reading.
    Again, you are free to run it on your system, but no one here wants it and any support means slicing more time from already overworked maintainers. Redhat has plenty of people, paid people, and they don't offer an init alternative. Why should funtoo?
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  9. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to AdiosKid in Some artwork for Funtoo (Wallpapers)   
  10. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to Sandro in Plasma 5.4   
    Hi Astate, i hope not to bored You !
    but install 
    # emerge eix then
    # eix-update or 
    # eix-sync (that is equal to emerge --sync && eix-update) So You can interrogate the eix db (that is faster than emerge -S (--search)
    I think is a very nice utility.
    If You want to use kde versions > kde 4.X
    I thik You must use "layman"
    # emerge layman # layman -L # layman -a kde # echo "source /var/lib/layman/make.conf">> /etc/portage/make.conf then when you'll make 
    # eix-update, it will be equal to  # emerge --sync && layman -S so you can re-interogate eix with
      # eix kde-meta # eix-kde-plasma  and so on .....
    Thiis are a normal prcedure; but it is possible that you encountered troubles. Now I'm making an experiment with these commands to give you a feedback.
    mmmmh at this moment i have not found an overlay with KDE 5.X .
    May be that i wrote, for you are jsut comprised.
    Unfortunately I have not found overlays that have kde5.X Perhaps what I wrote you know him already.   Sorry for not being able to give a solution. :(
  11. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to AdiosKid in Plasma 5.4   
  12. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Sorry to reply to an old post, but just saw this ...
    You are complaining that Funtoo isn't a serious alternative because its not like everyone else?  IMHO, its the ONLY alternative!  It's not much of an alternative if its exactly the same as everyone else.  And not giving you a choice?  Uhmm ... we aren't getting a choice from any of the mainstream distros, and they have way more resources to maintain different "choices".  I think you should bug them to support OpenRC!  That would be more fair.
    As for why the other distros chose to switch, its because of systemd's practices (Embrance, Extend, Extinguish?  Anyone else remember that philosophy?) where it looked like they would have to maintain such projects as udev and policykit and Gnome by themselves because of systemd dependencies.  At the time the decision was made, that was the way it looked.  Now, thanks to a very few people (wish I could remember their names, they need to be thanked and sponsored) those projects have non-systemd ports.  We may get Gnome a couple months late, but we get it.
    Funtoo is the brainchild of our BDFL ... if you trust him on the rest of the OS, trust him on this issue too.  In either case, its not a Democracy :)  You don't get to choose.  It IS Open-Source, so you could fork it, or back-port the changes to Gentoo and then run systemd all you want.    Just don't call it Funtoo if it runs systemd.   However, when it comes to drinking the systemd Kool-Aid or the Funtoo Kool-Aid, I choose Funtoo.
  13. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to nrc in My 2 cents on systemd   
    No, they're just other people's opinions and experiences.  The fact that they're different than yours doesn't disprove them.
    Systemd is exactly what Kernighan and Pike referred to as a "monolithic self-sufficient subsystem."   It's a collection of tightly coupled binaries, each of which does more than any single program intended for its purpose should in a UNIX-like environment. 
    It has nothing to do with hardware and OS bundling.  We're talking about the UNIX philosophy - portability across hardware was a key attribute from day one.  They were specifically talking about what programs do and how they interoperate.   
    Your comments suggest that you're not familiar with the UNIX philosophy.  Wikipedia has an entry that is a good starting place to learn more about it.
    You're free to think that the UNIX philosophy isn't really important today.   I believe that it was a key factor that enabled much of what we enjoy in the open source world today and that's important to maintaining those benefits in the future.

    Your numbers here are nonsense.  The systemd main function pulls in tens of thousands of lines of code from other source files.  Do you really believe that 2k of code compiles into a 1.5MB executable for systemd but 40KB for sysvint?   We're talking about a binary that is forty times larger.

    A person of the age that I seem in my picture recognizes that when someone says something ridiculous sometimes it's better to laugh at it than bother to argue with it.

    I don't care if you like systemd. Feel free to use a distribution that supports systemd.  You can sing its praises in the forums for those distros to your heart's content and you will never find me there arguing with you.
    I believe that systemd and the mindset that spawned it is harmful to Linux and open source in general.  I believe that it's important that we continue to have distributions that are dedicated to working without it.  For that reason I support Funtoo and I will argue against anyone who comes here and claims that systemd is a good thing or that Funtoo should support it.
  14. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Just because everyone else uses it doesn't mean I will. Everyone else used Windows95 too, and they also had about the same arguments. 
    I said NO, Linux is better. I'm not caving and 'its here to stay' is not a valid reason to use it.
    And '/etc/init.d/myservice start' works on most Unix systems. Its only systemd that changed that. Gentoo wasn't much of a learning curve and it didn't FORCE me. I even had other options and these did not affect the rest of the system. Normal sysV commands were wrapped and worked.
    Some day there will be something better, but not today.
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  15. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    No, but you are pretending that I don't already know these things and making it personal. Your English wasn't the issue. The fact is that the procedures that SHOULD work, don't. In spite of the fact that I shouldn't need to learn new commands, I have, and they fail.  
    The worst is when I tell systemd to stop a service and it says it did. I change a config file. I tell it to start the service, and it says it did. But ... no new config? I finally saw the pid never changed. I killed the process manually and restarted it and it worked fine. I lost hours because systemd lied to me.
    So, instead of answering my question on what value systemd brings, you make assumptions on my intelligence and my character and THIS is another reason I want no part of systemd. When asked why I need it, I'm told I must be stupid.
    Stupid me will stick with OpenRC until something better comes along ... and systemd isn't.
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  16. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Anywhere else
    init S
    You are telling me you don't know how either? "Would be easy" doesn't have the same effect as "The command is ..." In fact, "would be" sounds kinds iffy to me. This is pretty basic stuff. And if I have to ask an 'expert' just to get into a rescue mode that will actually let me check my filesystems ... something is very wrong!
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  17. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Internal network, not facing Internet. And even if it was, its double-NAT, one on my end (a Cisco ASA) and the other done by the ISP.
    You upgrade your kernel every week? There are weekly bugs that allow remote root access in the Linux kernel? Either the kernel devel team has gone to shit in recent years or you are straight up lying. Kernel issues that allow remote root (PWND? Are you 18?) are incredibly rare. The problem is almost always userspace. The last big one was blamed on bash, but was really idiots using bash to process CGI and not untainting properly ... totally wrong tool for the job and running user input from the web into your shell and executing it is so stupid ... I don't have words.
    Parsing systemd files faster than the shell? We could argue this for days, but its never going to be a noticeable difference and you took away part of my control ... and have me what in return? A microsecond faster boot? That's not a trade off I care to make. I don't upgrade my kernel every week and reboot all the time.
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  18. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    I'm still not seeing all these benefits that I'm supposed to have. You took away the little bit of programmability I had with the shell and gave me back a config file and told me its for my own good and now I have to go learn all these new stuff from shifty documentation.
    I never had a problem finding my boot logs. I do have a problem with systemd not letting me get to a true single user mode where I can fsck my partitions, let alone the root partition.
    Seriously, exactly what benefit do I get? And don't point me to a website. I've read the propoganda, but in practice, its not there. Instead I have a 1.6MB init instead of the old 36K init, and a directory full of tools (all in the hundreds of K). And I hear I need DBUS just to start a service .... cause I need more dependencies in my startup?
    Really, the small program mindset worked for Unix for the same reason OOP works, and why bastardizations of that philosophy are destroying computing. Encapsulation. With small binaries communicating through pipes the kernel enforces encapsulation and your API is stdin/stdout. Breaking encapsulation and enforcing dependencies is WRONG and systemd is all about enforced dependencies. I've been doing this too long not to see that this is a formula for a brittle system.
    For what benefit?
    I want LESS to break! KISS!
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  19. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    You have totally missed my point. I need to assign an IP address on an embedded system (yes, memory constrained like original Unix). I don't want systemd-networkd to be available. Telling me that its more efficient for systemd-networkd to parse its configs than it is for my shell to do it is nonsense. And why would I bother to learn this? It brings zero value other than I can't use the same syntax and command lines that have worked for 40 years.
    And the binary logs get corrupt and they just ignore it. There is a 'wont fix' bug report on it. Blatantly ignoring data corruption! I run systemd on my laptop and I know what crap it causes. When I have time, Funtoo will go back on the system and I can tell you from direct comparison that Funtoo ran just as fast, and had fewer problems.
    And you think uptimes of 2-3 weeks is good? I'd fire you. Before systemd uptimes were in years and then we asked what hardware component died.
    I think a lot of people have come to funtoo to get away from systemd. You won't find much love for that cancer here. Linux had become sad ... systemd, advertising, Ubuntu forcing you to use a search and then sharing the search with Amazon ... and in general really poor code stability from bloated software.
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  20. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Please stop. There are no lies nor exaggerations, just relations of personal experience ... from highly experienced people no less. For example, I'm not a moron and I can make GDM stop respawning! SO, instead of insinuating that I'm too dumb to make it stop, I obviously had some other point I was making.
    My point is that only systemd seems to think that this is a good idea! Even systems that (erroneously IMHO) respawn a service that dies, will refuse to do so without limits on the rate. This is absolutely dangerous and can bring a system to its knees. What if it died due to low memory? Running it again could cause something ELSE to die. If I wanted automatic service respawn, I'd have Nagios do it and it would be done right, and it would never respawn twice in 10 minutes, and would send me a text every time it did, with additional limits per hour/day/etc.
    The auto restart of services shows the mindset of the systemd developers. Us old Unix admins want to find the problem, fix it, then start the service ourself. Systemd tries to be "easy" and basically 'reboots' the service. Its Windows oriented thinking!
    Your constant use of personal attacks shows us you are frustrated because you have nothing relevant to contribute. Please stop calling everyone liars. Its not helping your argument.
    As for logs, I don't understand why you pretend its not an issue when you can just read the bug report that the logs get corrupt. And how compatible is all this with syslog? I want all my logs on one machine and when something goes dead, I read it on the log server. Does journalctl filter by machine? Or can systemd even handle syslog content from another machine without sending it through syslog?
    But I can install another system log to get the features I want ... wait ... Why would I switch to systemd which tries to take over a service, just to proxy it right back to the service that was supposed to handle it in the first place? You are building a house of cards with your server. You say systemd is modular, but your definition is different than mine. In my book, modular means that when my SATA drive dies, I can replace it with another from ANY vendor. Systemd is locking out the alternatives and so we can't easily replace those modules. Thus, its NOT modular, but maybe sectional. It does not play nice with others and so it will be punished with exile.
    Again, there is no benefit to using systemd, just stuff getting in my way. You talk of negligible latencies ... but what do I get in return for the latency? TROUBLE! Just dump systemd and use a real syslog.
    When I hear systemd, I think of that Taylor Swift song ... "I knew you were trouble when you walked in ..."
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  21. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    And FYI, comparing the init logic and saying its only 2K lines and sooo small ... its still 1.6MB compared to 37K for funtoo's init. So who's shoveling the BS? That's how many times larger? A few orders of magnitude
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  22. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Perhaps you don't see the horrible irony of priding yourself on giving us the ability to run systemd in funtoo after we've told you how much we hate it, despise it, and think its a spreading virus ... and you want an award for spreading it to funtoo? 
    Think about that. Don't expect a thank you!
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  23. Trolling
    pr1vacy reacted to uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    Its a shame you keep going. I use Funtoo because I trust Daniel and his decisions, mainly because we think alike on a lot of issues. I loved Gentoo in the early days, and realized that its decline was because they didn't listen to their founder. Basically, I followed Drobbins here from Gentoo. It was a lucky coincidence that we have similar views on systemd. 
    To insinuate that we came here because we hate systemd is just more of you lashing out. To do something like that would be childish, and you make this thread personal when you accuse people of childish things. You have a lot to learn.
    We don't like systemd because we tried it and evaluated it on its own merits, ran comparisons, and studied its design philosophies and, based upon our experience and how we think a Unix system should be administered, we simply don't think systemd is a good choice. Worse yet, the supporters of systemd, like yourself, feel some need to attack people that don't support your view. You feel that if we don't like systemd, we need to be educated. Well, that's insulting in the extreme! How dare you assume we can't make our own choices?
    And the systemd supporters like yourself, mainly due to pressure from Redhat (who's employee created this mess) are removing OUR freedom of choice. Linux had always been about choices and freedoms, and I VIOLENTLY oppose an initiative that seeks to remove the 'Free' from my 'Free Software'.
    Give the rest of us some credit and quit pretending we're idiots. Go have fun with systemd, just leave the rest of us out of it.
    More about me at https://eddon.systems
  24. Trolling
    pr1vacy got a reaction from uudruid74 in My 2 cents on systemd   
    It's roughly 50x the size cause it's that much better. :D
    I guess the obvious point to make is........
    Dude....this is Funtoo. Go find another forum to troll your jibberish to. Seriously.....Funtoo man. FUNTOO!
    One of the primary reasons people come to Funtoo is.....NO SYSTEMD!!!!!!!!
    Please go peddle this somewhere else. I'm confident the MAJORITY of Funtoo users do not want, need or care for systemd and MOSTLY not for what it does or doesn't do but because of how it goes against EVERYTHING Linux is fundamentally meant to be.....SIMPLE...and do ONE THING....and do it WELL.
    You of course can say whatever you want like I can. Freedom of speech. It's just this is really the wrong forum/website/place to be promoting shitdomD.
  25. Trolling
    pr1vacy got a reaction from nrc in My 2 cents on systemd   
    If anyone is interested in learning systemd (not SystemD...they get whiny over improper case use) then look here:
    Init Systems
  • Create New...